How are Hinduism and Sikhism related, considering they both originated in Punjab, India?
14.06.2025 08:26
Kaashi and Magahar - I consider them the same.
Says Kabeer, the Guru and Ganaysha and Shiva all know
I serve the One Lord, and not any other. ||2||
What are some effective ways to cope with loss and grief?
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ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਬੈਕੁੰਠੈ ਆਹਿ ॥੪॥੧੦॥
Ramarchan Paddati gives more info about his teachings.
How far does good behavior take you in a prison?
As mentioned above Guru Arjan Dev was talking from the perspective Sant Kabir whose views we have discussed much earlier here. We know that Sant Kabir continuing in the Ramanandi Sampradaya went further away from the mainstream ritualistic Hinduism and was journeying more towards a SEAMLESS Dharma.
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Gauri / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 325
I am a sacrifice to You, O my True Guru.
What's wrong with white women?
Where millions of Vishnus bow their heads, where millions of Brahmas are reading the Vedas,
From where did the word Maya come? Isn’t it a typical Vedantic concept discussed profoundly in Advaita? It definitely isn’t a concept pioneered by Kabir or even his teacher Ramanandacharya! It is ultimately from Sanatana Dharma!
Let's look at the views of Sant Kabir
I left Benares - I had little common sense. ||1|| Pause ||
We can see that great saints like Kabir and Ravidas etc… descended from the Ramananda sampradaya which is still the largest ascetic order in India.
Because in my previous life, I did not practice penance and intense meditation. ||1||
Do you agree with Michael Moore that Donald Trump is "toast" in a political comeback?
The young and the old drink milk pudding, but these fools eat the cow's body.
ਪੂਜਨ ਚਾਲੀ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਠਾਇ ॥
One day, a desire welled up in my mind.
What are some examples of a threat to democracy in India?
My body and breath of life belong to Allah - to Raam - the God of both. ||4||
I am not a Hindu, nor am I a Muslim.
That God showed me the Guru, within my own mind. ||1||
What do people with very high IQs do all day?
ਜਿਨਿ ਸਕਲ ਬਿਕਲ ਭ੍ਰਮ ਕਾਟੇ ਮੋਰ ॥
Look within your heart, for there you will find both Karim and Ram;
Sikhism is fundamentally rooted in BHAKTI tradition and thus ultimately in Sanatana Dharma. There is no doubt about it despite what modern McSikh acrobatics try to claim otherwise
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Sriraag / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 92
ਰਾਮਾਨੰਦ ਜੀ ਘਰੁ ੧
— Kabir, II.57, Translated by Rabindranath Tagore
ਕਬੀਰ ਨਿਰਗੁਣ ਨਾਮ ਨ ਰੋਸੁ ॥
Where the demi-gods and the munis are unnumbered, where millions of Saraswatis, goddess of music play the vina,
ਜਹਾ ਜਾਈਐ ਤਹ ਜਲ ਪਖਾਨ ॥
ਕਹੁ ਗੁਰ ਗਜ ਸਿਵ ਸਭੁ ਕੋ ਜਾਨੈ ॥
At the time of my death, I moved to Magahar. ||2||
ਬ੍ਰਹਮ is Brahm i.e the Brahman of vedanta but it gets interpreted as an all-pervading lord god.
The Sant Sampraday of Sikh panth integrates the warrior spirit of the Nihangs and Khalsa, the service of Seva panth and the renunciation of Udasi/Nirmala saints.
Kabir (a weaver)
NOW…
Says Kabeer, this is what I say:
ਮਰਤੀ ਬਾਰ ਮਗਹਰਿ ਉਠਿ ਆਇਆ ॥੨॥
Now here in this verse
Shvetashvatara Upanishad (6.23)
Now tell me, Lord, what will my condition be?
I have taken the One Formless Lord into my heart; I humbly worship Him there. ||3||
˗ˋˏ ♡ ˎˊ˗ NEW WOMAN - analysis ˗ˋˏ ♡ ˎˊ˗
— Kabir, Ramaini 1, Translated by David Lorenzen
I would go there, only if the Lord were not here. ||2||
ਮਰਨੁ ਭਇਆ ਮਗਹਰ ਕੀ ਬਾਸੀ ॥੩॥
ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਮੈ ਬਲਿਹਾਰੀ ਤੋਰ ॥
Hari is in the East, Allah is in the West.
ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਇਹੁ ਕੀਆ ਵਖਾਨਾ ॥
We have searched the turaki Dharam (Turk's religion, Islam), these teachers throw many thunderbolts,
Let’s look at the most used verse by McSikhs to show that Sikhs are neither Hindus nor Muslims.
ਗਉੜੀ ਕਬੀਰ ਜੀ ਪੰਚਪਦੇ ॥
Kabir, Ravidas and ultimately the NINE SIKH GURUS are a product of this very Sant Sampraday founded by Ramanandacharya!
I went to God's place, and worshipped Him there.
ਜਬ ਲਗੁ ਮਨਿ ਬੈਕੁੰਠ ਕੀ ਆਸ ॥
ਬਹੁਤੁ ਬਰਸ ਤਪੁ ਕੀਆ ਕਾਸੀ ॥
The divergence of Kabir’s views from Vedanta is seen in the fact that he fully opposed religious symbolism of ALL KINDS and not just IDOLS.
Wherever I go, I find water and stones.
There, where millions of Krishnas stand with hands folded,
Let’s see what Gurbani has about Ramanandacharya’s views.
You are totally pervading and permeating in all.
CONCLUSION:
Ravidas (a chamar shoemaker)
ਨਾ ਹਮ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਨ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ ॥
If Ram be within the image which you find upon your pilgrimage,
ਅਲਹ ਰਾਮ ਕੇ ਪਿੰਡੁ ਪਰਾਨ ॥੪॥
ਪੂਜਾ ਕਰਉ ਨ ਨਿਵਾਜ ਗੁਜਾਰਉ ॥
— Kabir, III.2, Translated by Rabindranath Tagore
The influence of Kabir is significant on Sikhism. The following Bani from Ang 1136 is attributed to GURU ARJAN DEV but if you observe at the end you can see that he was talking in the spirit of Sant Kabir.
I ground up sandalwood, along with several fragrant oils.
ਮੁਆ ਕਬੀਰੁ ਰਮਤ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਰਾਮੈ
ਏਕ ਦਿਵਸ ਮਨ ਭਈ ਉਮੰਗ ॥
That Kabeer died chanting the Lord's Name. ||5||15||
ਤਬ ਲਗੁ ਹੋਇ ਨਹੀ ਚਰਨ ਨਿਵਾਸੁ ॥੩॥
Kabeer: O worthless mortal, do not lose the Naam, the Name of the Lord.
The views of Kabir are very much in parallel to the Advaita philosophy and it is obvious that as the disciple of Ramanandacharya he will carry forward with his chosen NIRGUN BHAKTI.
There is a reason why I mention ROOTED and thus NOT implying that it belongs to one of the numerous sects in Sanatana Dharma like Shaivism, Vaishnavism, Shaktism, Smartism etc…
ਓਛੀ ਭਗਤਿ ਕੈਸੇ ਉਤਰਸਿ ਪਾਰੀ ॥੪॥
So in the same spirit Kabir finds pilgrimages to holy cities futile as his mind is fixated on Rama!
For many years, I practiced penance and intense meditation at Kaashi;
Sant Kabir was staunchly against cow slaughter.
ਪੂਰਬ ਜਨਮ ਹਉ ਤਪ ਕਾ ਹੀਨਾ ॥੧॥
ਤੂ ਪੂਰਿ ਰਹਿਓ ਹੈ ਸਭ ਸਮਾਨ ॥
There the streams of light flow in all directions, few are the men who can cross to that shore!
यस्य देवे परा भक्तिः यथा देवे तथा गुरौ । तस्यैते कथिता ह्यर्थाः प्रकाशन्ते महात्मनः प्रकाशन्ते महात्मन इति ।
ਗੁਰ ਕਾ ਸਬਦੁ ਕਾਟੈ ਕੋਟਿ ਕਰਮ ॥੩॥੧॥
ਮੇਰਾ ਚਿਤੁ ਨ ਚਲੈ ਮਨੁ ਭਇਓ ਪੰਗੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Where should I go? My home is filled with bliss.
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Raamaanand's Lord and Master is the All-pervading Lord God.
I do not make pilgrimages to Mecca, nor do I worship at Hindu sacred shrines.
ਊਹਾਂ ਤਉ ਜਾਈਐ ਜਉ ਈਹਾਂ ਨ ਹੋਇ ॥੨॥
Gauree, Kabeer Jee, Panch-Padas:
ਘਸਿ ਚੰਦਨ ਚੋਆ ਬਹੁ ਸੁਗੰਧ ॥
ਹਜ ਕਾਬੈ ਜਾਉ ਨ ਤੀਰਥ ਪੂਜਾ ॥
Kabir is the child of Allah and of Ram: He is my Guru, He is my Pir.
All the men and women of the world are His living forms.
For him Dharma was beyond everything physical including the desire for heaven because was fully into the NIRGUN . The last verse shows that according to him the company of the enlightened Sadhus is heaven which is again a typical teaching of Sanatana Dharma.
He accepted even women (Sursuri and Padywati) as disciples. Bhagat Pipa and Dhanna were Rajput and Jat who were also his disciples.
ਸੋ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਬਤਾਇਓ ਗੁਰ ਮਨ ਹੀ ਮਾਹਿ ॥੧॥
ਅਬ ਕਹੁ ਰਾਮ ਕਵਨ ਗਤਿ ਮੋਰੀ ॥
Where millions of Shivas are lost in contemplation, where millions of Indras dwell in the sky,
I wasted my whole life in the city of Shiva;
ਸਗਲ ਜਨਮੁ ਸਿਵ ਪੁਰੀ ਗਵਾਇਆ ॥
Sikhism is a NIRGUN path descending from the Sant Sampraday of Ramanandacharya and traces its ideas to VEDANTA!
ਗੁਰ ਪੀਰ ਮਿਲਿ ਖੁਦਿ ਖਸਮੁ ਪਛਾਨਾ ॥੫॥੩॥
There is my Lord self-revealed, and the scent of sandal and flowers dwells in those deeps.
then who is there to know what happens without?
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Ramananda accepted disciples without discriminating against anyone by gender, class or caste and they included even people from humble origins like
I am like a fish out of water,
ਏਕ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਲੇ ਰਿਦੈ ਨਮਸਕਾਰਉ ॥੩॥
He who has highest Bhakti of Deva (God), just like his Deva, so for his Guru (teacher),
ਜਿਉ ਜਲ ਛੋਡਿ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਭਇਓ ਮੀਨਾ ॥
To him who is high-minded, these teachings will be illuminating.
We can understand that Kabir despite being in favor of formless worship was very much embedded in the Dharmik fold but always preached in the spirit of the transcendental nature of Brahman to the point that HE LOST THE DISTINCTION BETWEEN HINDU AND MUSLIM.
One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:
Ramanandacharya’s teachings were centered on pure and personal connection with the God Rama and didn’t believe in any kind of formal ritualism. He used the common vernacular language instead of Sanskrit so that everyone could understand.
ਬੇਦ ਪੁਰਾਨ ਸਭ ਦੇਖੇ ਜੋਇ ॥
My consciousness does not go out wandering. My mind has become crippled. ||1|| Pause ||
Now that my time to die has come, I have come to dwell at Magahar! ||3||
I do not perform Hindu worship services, nor do I offer the Muslim prayers.
Meeting with the Guru, my Spiritual Teacher, I realize God, my Lord and Master. ||5||3||
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ਕੈਸੇ ਬੂਝੈ ਜਬ ਮੋਹਿਆ ਹੈ ਮਾਇਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Again we see that the originator of this Sant Sampraday himself talks about Brahman even in Gurbani.
ਕਤ ਜਾਈਐ ਰੇ ਘਰ ਲਾਗੋ ਰੰਗੁ ॥
Actually, this part of the Ang 326 is widely used by McSikhs to show that Sikhism considers Hindu pilgrimages as useless and thus drives home the point again that the “religion” has got NOTHING to do with Hinduism.
I have searched through all the Vedas and the Puraanas.
ਤਜੀ ਲੇ ਬਨਾਰਸ ਮਤਿ ਭਈ ਥੋਰੀ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Sain (a barber)
From Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 1195
The Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, is heaven. ||4||10||
With inadequate devotion, how can anyone swim across? ||4||
Bhakti movement began in South (Tamil Nadu to be precise) and slowly spread to Northern parts of India. This movement was extremely popular because of its simple fundamentals which could be understood by even commonfolk. Vaishnavism, Shaivism etc… were already connecting with commonfolk from a long time and this Bhakti movement reinforced it by making the devotee feel a personal connection with the deity.
But we have actually seen how much Kabir is also rooted in the Vedantic concept of “supreme realization” but in a non-mainstream path.
Where spring, the lord of seasons reigneth, there the unstruck music sounds of itself,
Says Kabeer, unto whom should I tell this?
I am not a Hindu, nor am I a Muslim.
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ਕਾਸੀ ਮਗਹਰ ਸਮ ਬੀਚਾਰੀ ॥
ਏਕੋ ਸੇਵੀ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਦੂਜਾ ॥੨॥
If God be within the mosque, then to whom does this world belong?
ਰਾਮਾਨੰਦ ਸੁਆਮੀ ਰਮਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ॥
Here ਨਿਰਗੁਣ is Nirgun and not just lord. This is just another example to show that Kabir himself continued in the NIRGUN BHAKTI path.
Ramanandacharya was a 14th-century Hindu Vaishnava devotional poet saint who amalgamated Advaita with Vaishnava Bhakti. He was the pioneer in validating NIRGUN and SAGUN Bhakti as parallel paths.
ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਇਹ ਕਹੀਐ ਕਾਹਿ ॥
Raamaanand Jee, First House:
How can people understand You, when they are entranced by Maya? ||1|| Pause ||
ਮੁਆ ਕਬੀਰੁ ਰਮਤ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਰਾਮੈ ॥੫॥੧੫॥
How can they kill the mother, whose milk they drink like that of a wet nurse?
As long as the mind is filled with the desire for heaven,
He does not dwell at the Lord's Feet. ||3||
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Gauri / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 326
Raamaanand's Lord and Master is the All-pervading Lord God.
ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥
Here ਰਾਮੈ is Rama and not just lord. Kabir died chanting the name of Rama DESPITE him not finding any result of penances done in holy cities in his previous birth. Another example to show how much Kabir valued personal devotion to Rama in his own NIRGUN style.
Sadhna (a Muslim butcher) and
These morons know nothing, they wander about in ignorance,
For a superficial McSikh who is interested only in separation and not enlightenment the views of Kabir can be easily shown as a denouncement of Hindu practices.
You have cut through all my confusion and doubt.
The Word of the Guru's Shabad eradicates the karma of millions of past actions. ||3||1||
Guru Nanak (right) and Bhai Mardana (foreground) with Bhagat Kabir (left). This painting is found in the B-40 Janamsakhi, written and painted in 1733. The painting was made by Alam Chand Raj
ਨਾ ਹਮ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਨ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ ॥
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Gauri / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 325
Without looking into one's heart, how can one reach paradise?
ਰਾਮਾਨੰਦ ਸੁਆਮੀ ਰਮਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ॥
Recklessly they display boundless pride while explaining their own aims, they kill cows.